HMRC Is Shite

HMRC Is Shite
Dedicated to the taxpayers of Britain, and the employees of Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs (HMRC), who have to endure the monumental shambles that is HMRC.

Tuesday, 19 July 2011

Ker Farking Ching!

KerfarkingchingThanks to the incompetence of our political "elite", the country is broke.

Therefore no one should be under any illusions that the state, in order to maintain its existence, will do all it can to extract every last penny from the taxpayers.

ICAS have issued a timely warning concerning the aggressive new penalty regime being applied by HMRC as from October.

Instant £100 fines will be applied for even a one day delay in filing, together with additional fines for lengthier delays.

"If people are even one day late in filing their paper self-assessment tax form they will be hit with an instant £100 fine. After another three months an additional fine of £10 a day is added for each day overdue, up to a maximum of £900. Tougher fines are added if passing the six month or one year mark; the larger of £300 or five per cent of the tax due.

From the 31 January next year the same will apply for people who file their form online. So a return due by the end of January 2012 but not filed until 5 August 2012 would attract £1,300 or higher in fines.

According to ICAS, the professional body of Chartered Accountants (CAs), since self-assessment was introduced in 1997, nearly one million people each year have been late in filing their return. Many people delay submitting their return for longer than 12 months. Until now so long as the person had paid all the tax due no penalty could be charged by HMRC.

Derek Allen, Director of Tax at ICAS, said:

'We are concerned that most people will not yet be aware of these new penalties as they have not been widely communicated. Based on the last decade of experience, at least one million people could find themselves liable to the additional penalties.'

The new penalties could also see taxpayers losing out on tax rebates from HMRC. This is particularly relevant for self- employed in the construction sector, where tax is often deducted initially by the contractors. Individuals are then due repayments after calculation once they lodge a return. However, under the new rules if the return is late the repayment owed will be a lot less because it has been used by penalties.
"

Suck it up people, the country is broke and the political "elite" have no intention of removing their snouts from the trough.

Ker Farking Ching!


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28 comments:

  1. A wee incentive to get your return in on time

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  2. Last time I checked it was 7 months to file a paper return or 10months online, exactly how much time do people want?

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  3. In fairness Ken people have plenty of time to file. Sorry but can't agree on this one.

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  4. I agree with the comments above but let's not forget it can take up to three months for HMRC to register the receipt of an SA return so an "instant fine" is quite a funny concept.

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  5. What about a few fines for hmrc.

    The data lossess, cock ups that would have had a private companys feet not touch the ground as it flew through the air.

    When is Lesley gonna be before a committee again?

    "And now let's get things started
    Why don't you get things started
    It's time to get things started
    On the most sensational inspirational celebrational Muppetational
    This is what we call the Muppet Show!"

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  6. Leslie Straithie won't be appearing before any committees for a while she has openly informed staff she is going into hospital and will be absent for 3 months.
    Now, what was that nonsense about sickness management and doctor's appointments and interventions etc?

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  7. The deadlines and new penalties are highlighted in a boxed section on the front page of the Return. The instructions also state the penalties are still payable even if no tax is due. The full details of the new penalty regime are found in seconds on the HMRC website. This time, the Revenue has made it as clear as daylight.

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  8. This isn't exactly a revelation. The planning for this is in S106 Finance Act 2009 and S26 Finance (No 3) Act 2010. and the changes to TMA1970 are made through various statutory instruments listed here.

    These changes were made possible by governments of all colours. A bonus though is perhaps it will stop the bulk repayment cowboy agents from suddenly opening up shop in December, insisting on requesting CIS statement info from HMRC instead of their client (which HMRC is under no obligation whatsoever to provide, not even under the DPA as agents cannot make a request under the DPA unless their client signs something which they wouldn't because hopefully they'd be thinking hang on a minute what am I paying this person for?) and charging each client 40% of the repayment for their extremely hard job of transferring the information to the self employment page of the return.

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  9. the new penalty guidance was issued with all notices to file and paper returns in April on an A4 sheet of paper. If people fail to read this,or don't file on time - it's their own fault - HMRC can't be blamed, as they do offer enough time to file it.

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  10. Is the 103rd acting beyond its remit?
    Accepting that the right tax at the right time is a responsibilty of the end user or customer.
    Punitive fiscal penalties may not be the answer.
    For any tax system to worr properly with compliance at its core requires credibilty and belief in the administration of the system.
    When the customer and the work force of the administration are thinking and believing the same things one thing is for sure, things are not right at the HMRC.

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  11. @19 July 2011 20:29

    You've reminded me of the complaints that are received about this by phone or letter......

    Captain Ignorant: "You've hidden this somewhere in your bureaucratic form haven't you? I haven't got time to read through every single thing you send me - where did you 'hide' this information?"

    Reply: "Umm, on the front page?"

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  12. @19 July 2011 20:49

    Have you not been reading the replies so far?

    HMRC do not write tax law - so how can it be acting outside it's remit? They may have a hand in giving advice but then again so do accountants but I don't see people accusing them of acting outside their remit.

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  13. @9 July 2011 20:42

    Yes. Unlike some countries I could mention that allow precisely 4 months and 15 days to not only file the return for the previous year but calculate themselves and pay the tax due as well? (May I remind you that everyone in that country is required to file a return).

    HMRC staff are required to nanny the citizens of the UK and those who are subject to UK income tax so much that with the dwindling staff it gets bogged down in nonsense created by this nannying and Ken cannot disagree with this as he also runs a site called 'Nanny knows best'.

    Sorry HMRC cannot act as your personal accountant looking after you through each tax year and knowing exactly when you will take a drop in income or suddenly your income increases by some 60K. You get the service that you apathetically didn't vote for to be honest.

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  14. 19th @ 21:01
    It all depends on your definition of remit!
    Whilst the 103rd may not write the law they certainly act within and sometimes outwith it. Otherwise this blog site has been feasting upon untruths for years, now you don't really believe that do you?
    No smoke without fire, never mind all that has been proven in court or elsewhere.
    19th @ 21:30
    Unless I am mistaken HMRC staff are there, as Civil Servants, to provide support and guidance to enhance the customer centric experience that the customer is subjected to!

    Unless the majority of HMRC staff, customers and agents are very mistaken HMRCISSHITE. Nobody wants it to remain that way but its going to take a miracle of sorts to turn the whole thing around.

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  15. "Unless I am mistaken HMRC staff are there, as Civil Servants, to provide support and guidance to enhance the customer centric experience that the customer is subjected to!"

    Trouble is there are posters on this site who cannot grasp that concept.

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  16. "Leslie Straithie won't be appearing before any committees for a while she has openly informed staff she is going into hospital and will be absent for 3 months.
    Now, what was that nonsense about sickness management and doctor's appointments and interventions etc?"

    Has anyone got her telephone number? so we can ring her up everyday like my partners team leader was supposed to do when they where off sick. Mind you they soon stopped ringing once they where told where the phone was going.

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  17. "Unless I am mistaken HMRC staff are there, as Civil Servants, to provide support and guidance to enhance the customer centric experience that the customer is subjected to!"

    You are mistaken. Most of us are there to provide statistical proof that senior management are successfully reducing costs whilst still bringing money in.

    Only a hand full of people are still involved in providing support and guidance. The instructions from the ivory tower is that anyone who wants help with taxation should get an accountant.

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  18. 20 July 2011 09:46


    Spot on.

    The tax payer isnt on the radar.

    Its bascially a massive Excel spreadsheet department adjusted, ameneded, printed, emailed etc so that managers can pass stats on up the line to a moron more senior than a Senior Officer.

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  19. @21.30 God help HMRC if everyone had to file a Return. It struggles wit 9 million. WTF would it do with 50 million. Titanic waiting for an iceberg..

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  20. @19 July 2011 22:35 and 20 July 2011 08:20.

    Just a few hours ago HMRC was accused of breaking its remit.

    Just like the Land Registry can't give you advice on improvements to your house and the FCO/Home office can't support your visa application. HMRC cannot guide you through your day to day tax affairs on the limited information it receives or has the capacity to process,

    Even when RTI comes in it will be an almost impossible task, there will be worklists generated every month that will eventually add up to a number that looks similar to the national debt of the United States.

    As was stated, members of the public were happy to see what was sold to them as 'whitehall waste' but then come here and complain when the £$%* hit's the fan.

    If you want the level of support that was received a decade ago, then the department needs to get back in to the same shape it was a decade ago and the cynical enquiry centre closure programme also needs to stop.

    The 'Big Society' has meant that pensioners have to rely on charities like TOP (Taxhelp for Older People) instead of the previously fully staffed enquiry centres - but the agents that work for them have unrealistic expectations.

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  21. @19 July 2011 22:35

    I might also add that this site can trace its roots back to 2007, two years after the merger and subsequent 'efficiencies' e.g. job losses.

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  22. I have noticed that comments from the 'have cake, will eat' brigade of the culture - that has been led to believe that either neo-conservatism or neo-liberalism will solve everyones problems - seem to have nothing to say on here when presented with a realistic outcome of their own idealistic version of how they wish HMRC to operate.

    It seems to me that the most astute 'self made man' blames all of their failures on an 'interfering government bureaucracy'. Tim Martin, the chairman of a well known UK pub chain does it on an almost monthly basis through the magazine printed for customers at his pub chain.

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  23. Whether spoons gives the customer what it wants is pretty obvious.

    Cheap beer of a standard that keeps CAMRA happy, cheap, good quality food...

    Plus a good amount of consisyency "across the piste" as they like to say.

    Staff and management "engage" with the customer.

    Send Excom to Wheter spoons, to work and learn.

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  24. 20 July 2011 @19:53

    "...The 'Big Society' has meant that pensioners have to rely on charities like TOP (Taxhelp for Older People) instead of the previously fully staffed enquiry centres...."

    I'm sure i've seem somewhere that TOP is actually part funded by HMRC!?

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  25. @21 July 2011 07:22

    Getting off topic but...

    I suggest you read the letters page of the magazine which is basically where Tim gets off his soap box and uses his right to reply makes snide remarks about his customers grumbles.

    Consistency? You mean like having different prices in the same town? (and no I'm not talking about higher prices at Lloyds No 1 Bar.

    Anyway getting back on track, I expect the service that I pay for, Whether it be whetherspoons or elsewhere.

    The cost of running HMRC is estimated by one of the 'big four' at <a href="http://services.parliament.uk/hansard/Commons/ByDate/20110302/mainchamberdebates/part006.html> less than a penny in every pound</a> of GDP yet it is one of the biggest govt departments?

    Pretty sure HMRC waste isn't the problem. The successive scapegoating of HMRC by the govt and the tabloids trying to cut even more staff maybe?

    A quick check on Google shows that nanny's are paid between £8-£12 an hour on average. The salary of the average staff answering your query is nearer the bottom end of that.

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  26. 20 July 2011 @19:53

    Yes, they contribute £240,000 better known as a 'Clasper' or 13 fairly experienced enquiry centre staff members.

    Chances are they probably contribute more in gift aid then they actually do in this grant.

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  27. Have to chuckle.....

    I doubt most UK taxpayers even realize WHO they are paying. You think it's the government? Sure, it appears that way, it's meant to but all your taxes are levied to pay someone else entirely.

    You are actually paying interest in a Fiat currency, owned and controlled by a bank - cleverly called the Bank of England. Most people believe that this is a government run and owned institution or operation. It isn't.

    The jolly old Bank of England is a private corporation run for the benefit of shareholders. They own the money supply - by "own" I mean literally. They have the power to contract or expand the money supply at will. When governments need money the only place they can get it, just like everyone else, including all other banks, corporations and businesses, is to borrow it from this institution (at interest) which has a complete and utter monopoly on your country's currency. Quite literally a licence to print money. Yes, Sterling is owned, produced and controlled by one powerful private cartel of bankers.

    So how, you might ask, does the interest on the money that the bank manufactures and then "lends" ever get paid off? Well, as all money comes from the same place, you need more money from the same source to pay the interest....so basically it can never be paid off and this is why no national debt can ever be settled in any country with a privately owned central bank.

    Such a debt based banking system is effectively a Ponzi scheme which will inevitably collapse. It is simply not sustainable forever.

    Maybe this will start to give you an inkling of why politics, political parties, governments and your belief that you live in a democracy are all an elaborate illusion. Those who wield the real power are the owners of the money supply, because ownership of that, gives you ownership of everything and everyone.

    This system ensures that every unit of currency "produced" comes with interest attached so you are unavoidably born into debt and enslaved by debt even if you've never borrowed a penny - because every pound in your pocket is already weighed down with interest.

    Doubting Thomases can learn more about fractional reserve banking, Fiat currencies, the history of the private European banking families and that of the Federal Reserve (America's privately owned central bank) in an excellent documentary now available on Google Video which explains in detail how international bankers secured such immense power and how we arrived at the money system that effectively enslaves us all from cradle to grave.

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936

    You might well wonder just what the bankers hope to achieve if it's all such a house of cards? Well, their aim according to many is a one world bank, a one world currency, a one world government - all controlled by themselves and other self appointed elites. A return to feudalism on a global scale. The signs are all there for those who wish to understand it.

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  28. Fines and penalties only work one way with HMRC.

    If I was brain dead with no moral compass and want to molest little old ladies for a few pence on their personal tax returns - I would become a tax inspector

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