My thanks to a loyal reader who made an effort, via and FOI request, to try to get to the bottom of the "BMW Debate" that has been raging on this site a for a while now.
He has forwarded me the answer from HMRC (see above).
I will leave him to comment as to what his next steps may, or may not be.
Again though, thanks for doing this!
HMRC Is Shite (www.hmrcisshite.com), also available via the domain www.hmrconline.com, is brought to you by www.kenfrost.com "The Living Brand"
Thank you Ken.
ReplyDeleteI have requested an internal review of the reply from HMRC. I have asked for more detail regarding make of vehicles and conditions of use as a matter of public interest.
HMRC have acknowledged receipt of my request and promised a response by 27th of February.
I will update you when I hear anything.
Thanks
DeleteGreat work, thank you. HMRC's reply is, frankly, disgusting and they're breaking the law by not complying with the FoI request.
DeleteAnd if HMRC were to get serious about compromising operational use of vehicles, they would forthwith stop the appalling practice of allowing HMRC employees to take official vehicles homes home - and, indeed, the blind eye seemingly turned to private use.
It's disgraceful
Great content. My thanks to the person who submitted this very precise FOI and to Ken for publishing it.
ReplyDeleteBMW is one of the "12" manufacturers used by HMRC. It's going to be interesting to see what the other 11 are and whether private use is permitted (or not). That's assuming HMRC don't continue to frustrate a reasonable FOI that is in the public interest.
Tom Cruise drove a BMW in Mission Impossible Rogue Nation
ReplyDeleteIf it's good enough for Tom Cruise it's good enough for Field Force when they're knocking the doorbell of Bingo Betty for her £80.
James Bond had one in Tomorrow Never Dies..
HMRC is Tomorrow we'll Never Answer The Phone....
🤣🤣🤣 Looking forward to these scumbags providing the FOI information the public are entitled to have. They must be defeated on this one
DeleteI'd like a Ferrari from HMRC. Is it worth giving up my accountancy career and taking a job as a field tax collector with HMRC? 😉
ReplyDeleteIf you lack morals, HMRC is the place to be - - go for it!!! LOL
DeleteAnother HMRC Tool that's a total dogpile. We'll be paying through the beak for the fix and replacement. Apologies all round. Heads I win Tails you lose.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/pensions/state-pensions/state-pension-forecasts-can-be-wrong-hmrc-admits/
I fear HMRC will not back down from their unreasonable blocking of the foi request.
ReplyDeleteThis is a case for the ICO to get stuck into.
Curious to hear what HMRC respond with on this matter. Nobody is asking for precise details (reg plates, whereabouts etc) but we are entitled to know what cars our tax money is used to fund.
ReplyDeleteWe've been enjoying the 'HMRC BMW scandal' in our office but have noticed it's gone very quiet.
ReplyDeleteIt looks like the original contributor was correct: HMRC have given mobile staff BMWs!!! You couldn't make it up.
Anyone have any updates?
Hmrc are laughing at us. I've had the heating switched off over winter to pay my self assessment tax bill, while these fucking leeches get treated to luxuries far in excess of what's needed to do the their little jobs. BMW, Mercedes...🙄 Does Rachel Reeves even know about what's going on inside HMRC!!!!? Maybe she'll announce investigations into them during the Spring Statement today..
DeleteIt seems like luxury cars are for layabouts and scroungers nowadays. Bmw cars et al for HMRC staff, BMW cars et al for the Mobility Scheme.
DeleteAll paid for by everyday taxpayers who get no benefits at all
@17:39
DeleteYour point about luxury cars is valid. Take exception to all staff being called layabouts or scroungers. I served in the department across three decades and worked hard for quite low pay. I was out on the road regularly - towns and cities, villages and farms. Alas, we didn't have BMs in those days. It was all budget -Peugeots, Fiestas, Astras. The fact that senior managers saw fit to authorise luxury cars for staff, especially during a so-called cost of living crisis, or greedflation, illustrates just how far they've fallen into the moral abyss.
Yesterday I asked HMRC why I hadn't received a reply to my request for an internal review of the initial response to my FoI question.
ReplyDeleteHMRC have replied that they were unable to meet the 20 working days deadline due to the complexity of putting a full reply together. They have said that they should be able to reply "shortly".
On the plus side this would indicate that they are at least taking the matter seriously.
I will update as and when.
As one of those who have followed the BMW scandal keenly since it came to light, I'm very grateful for the update.
DeleteIt's a shame they haven't worked to expedite a full reply (and to provide the information the public are entitled to). Agree that it's positive that they at least seem to be taking the matter seriously now.
Thanks for your work on this.
Any updates on the HMRC BMW/luxury car disgrace? HMRC must be laughing at the person who made the FOI as their rights are being totally violated
ReplyDeleteMy request for an internal review of the reply to my FoI question was received by HMRC on 30th January. Where a review involves complex research it is generally regarded that 40 working days is the upper limit for a reply.
DeleteThat would take us up the 27th March.
As yet my rights are not being violated.
Today marks 40 working days since HMRC acknowledged receipt of my request for an internal review of their response to my FOI submission.
ReplyDeleteI have emailed them for an urgent update on what is happening.
I will let you know their response.
Thank you for the update.
DeleteWonder what they are covering up?
@14:25.
DeleteGlad to see that you're keeping an open mind.
They don't want the public knowing that tax collectors are driving around in BMWs and other luxury cars which are paid for by taxpayers. It's definitely wrong on so many different levels. But the cover up is probably as simple as that. No conspiracy theories needed: this is routine, casual corruption
Delete@07:26 That's exactly what's going on here. They're abusing the FOI process. The ICO need to be involved. HMRC will not back down on this - they will simply do anything to make sure the public don't find out how their money is wasted
Delete@07:26, what "other luxury cars"? Do you know something?
Delete@13:30, out of interest have you ever actually done anything to expose the corrupt?
@18:05 I have indeed exposed countless corruption involving public officials.
DeleteMy current focus is on exposing fraudsters, bullies, abusers, sex offenders and other miscreants collecting a wage from the public purse at HMRC. Those people have no place in the civil service - and they will be exposed. I'm putting them on notice: the days of hiding behind the name "HMRC" to avoid accountability for crime and/or misconduct are over. Only those with something to hide have anything to fear.
@13:22 & @18:05
DeleteI have a proud track record of identifying corrupt HMRC/public servants and exposing them in the public interest. Very happy to collaborate if either have information and I will help investigate and progress your case. First class investigation skills utilised to expose misconduct
@13:22 and @14:39. That sounds great and well done to you both.
DeleteWould you care to share the details of any of your successes with the rest of us.
We love hearing about all the corruption at HMRC, entertaining for us based in a provincial accountancy firm - keep up the good work guys!!!
Delete@10:04 I would prefer there was no corruption at HMRC. What alleged misconduct is it that you most enjoy reading about!?
DeleteHappy Easter Ken and all loyal readers.
ReplyDeleteFeels like the BMW debacle has been rolling since before Christmas. Here's my prediction; HMRC will refuse the FoI and take their chances in the unlikely scenario thst the ICO are asked to pursue. Obviously they don't want the public knowing that staff are supplied with BMWs.
@16:51. Why do you think that the ICO being asked to pursue the matter would be an "unlikely scenario"?
DeleteDo you know something that the rest of us don't?
@16:51 What? If HMRC does not comply with the FOI, the matter absolutely must be referred to the ICO - no ifs or buts.
DeleteThe ICO itself must take enforcement action against this rogue authority
@11:11
DeleteYour question should be why aren't the ICO already pursuing the matter, yes?
You haven't replied yet to my question of 1st April @16:42.
DeletePlease don't be coy. I'm really interested in your successes to defeat corruption.
@19:12. No, it shouldn't.
DeleteWhy would the ICO be pursuing the matter if it hasn't been referred to them yet. It hasn't been referred to them yet because the outcome of HMRC's internal review hasn't been received.
So if HMRC's internal review is dragged out for an indefinite period, you delay referring it to the ICO for an indefinite period and HMRC just get away with it. Crazy and illogical 😂 🤡 🤡
DeleteThe masters of cover-up are clearly in charge of this situation
Pretty much, yeah. We all knew it would never be confirmed nor denied
Delete@13:20.
DeleteYou're the only person who's mentioned "indefinite period".
Easy to criticise other people when you're sat on your backside doing nothing.
Care to share any of your proud track record of bringing HMRC staff to account? Rhetorical question - of course you won't.
I wasn't criticising. Don't be so sensitive. Merely pointing out how gullible it would be to wait for the internal review to conclude. How long is a piece of string?
DeleteYou were criticising and I'm not being sensitive. You chose to attempt to ridicule me by posting clown emojis.
DeleteNo details on your "proud track record" I notice.
Waiting for the internal review forever and day is gullible, that's true princess 😂🤡 🤡
Delete@11:58.
DeleteI'm not waiting for the results of the review "forever", so your point is meaningless.
"Crazy", "illogical", "gullible", "princess" and clown emojis but you're not criticising!!!
And everyone is noticing that you're not sharing your "proud track record" with the rest of us.
If I gave the names and/or job titles of the corrupt officials I've exposed, I sense you would cry about some kind of imagined and perceived 'unfairness'. Suffice to say, princess - I've exposed multiple of corrupt people. My work is not done: only those who have done wrong have anything to worry about 🤡
DeleteThe flaw in that argument is that if you had 'exposed corrupt officials' it would be matter of public record. Saying that you will not give any details of your heroic deeds because I am a "princess" and I will "cry" is beyond pathetic.
DeleteI realise that this site is probably some kind of therapy session for you but try and have a bit of self-respect.
No, it would necessarily be a matter of 'public record', princess.
DeleteTherapy for what?
Btw it's try *to*, not try *and*... 🤡
I will continue exposing any and all corrupt HMRC officials, and do so unapologetically...
There are two types of HMRC official - those who act with honesty and integrity, and those who don't...
DeleteAlways very telling as to the kind of person we're dealing with when that person has an issue with those who expose corruption. Some might call such a character and enabler - out of fear of triggering the delicate, I couldn't possibly comment...
Meanwhile, the BMW FOI remains outstanding...
@08:58.
DeleteNobody has an issue with those who expose corruption.
But hurling vague accusations against unnamed people on the internet and then claiming that this gives you a proud track record as an exposer of corruption is absurd in the extreme.
Surely even a self-publicising narcissist like you can see this.
If the BBC can just sack a star presenter over 'allegations' why does HMRC hang on to wrong 'uns with both serious allegations and proven wrongdoing hanging over them??
ReplyDelete@18:23.
ReplyDeleteGlad you agree it would necessarily be a matter of public record 🤡🤡.
And you haven't exposed any corrupt officials outside of your fevered imagination.
@12:46 I've exposed countless corrupt staff, public record or otherwise.
DeleteYou are an apologist for them - are you an enabler too?
Who are you? 🤡
@18:23 Poor man, think you need to speak to a doctor sir lol 😆 🤣😂
Delete@13:36.
DeleteThis is getting crushingly tedious but I'll try again.
Which corrupt staff have you exposed?
And who are you?🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡
Bet you would love to know what went on in my office?
Delete@16:17.
DeleteYou can always tell us.
Can anyone kindly update us all about the "BMW FOI"? As Reeves grabs even more from us this year, we would like to know where it's being spent?
ReplyDeleteSorry, there are no updates at this time. The matter is being quietly swept under the rug.
DeleteHMRC will not let people know that their tax money is people used to lease BMWs for debt collectors...but it must be exposed. Fight for the truth...fight, fight, fight for the truth, always
DeleteHMRC are being disingenuous. Field collectors do not routinely detect crime; absolute BS and they know it - though some of the walter mitty types in field force would like to think they do. Also, confirming manufacturer names used (e.g BMW, Mercedes, Ford etc) without any other identifying information such as model and/or colour and/or registration number would not "interfere" with the civil enforcement activity (eg. seize someone's sofa or telly for an unpaid tax bill) that field collectors occasionally undertake.
ReplyDeleteAnd if they were that worried about compromising 'staff safety' there'd be a blanket ban on using personal vehicles and on keeping any vehicles used for HMRC business at home addresses. When I was a field collector, on more than one occasion, incompetent staff from Enterprise posted the rental paperwork identifying me as an HMRC employee through neighbours' letterboxes. HMRC didn't give a f**k.
Plus, if they cared about staff safety, they'd do something to address the internal staff bullying culture.
Sorry, but they're not being straight with us, and if that's their best argument, it illustrates how desperate they are to suppress the truth.
Kudos to the reader who made the effort, though.
@13:59 I detect and expose crime and misconduct within HMRC as they are failing in their duty to uphold standards.
DeleteShould you have any helpful information, feel free to reach out
@16:32.
DeleteI'll try again.
What crime within HMRC have you exposed?
Just one example would be a start.